Metrofocus: June 2, 2022

> TONIGHT, THE FORGOTTEN STORY OF ARTISTS WHO PAINTED HUNDREDS OF PROTESTING MURALS IN NEW YORK AFTER GEORGE FLOYD'S MURDER.

AND OUR MENTAL HEALTH SERIES IS BACK WITH A REVEAL LOOK AT THE MIND/BODY CONNECTION AND HOW TO FEEL YOUR BEST.

'METROFOCUS' STARTS RIGHT NOW.

♪♪

> THIS IS 'METROFOCUS,' WITH RAFAEL PI ROMAN, JACK FORD AND JENNA FLANAGAN.

'METROFOCUS' IS MADE POSSIBLE BY -- SUE AND EDGAR WACHENHEIM III, THE PETER G. PETERSON AND JOAN GANZ COONEY FUND, BERNARD AND DENISE SCHWARTZ, BARBARA HOPE ZUCKERBERG, THE AMBROSE MONELL FOUNDATION.

AND BY --

> GOOD EVENING, AND WELCOME TO 'METROFOCUS.'

I'M JENNA FLANAGAN.

IT'S BEEN TWO YEARS SINCE GEORGE FLOYD'S MURDER LED TO THOUSANDS OF PROTESTERS FLOODING THE STREETS OF NEW YORK CITY WITH THE MESSAGE THAT BLACK LIVES MATTER.

AMID THE PUSH FOR RACIAL JUSTICE, BUSINESSES BOARDED UP THEIR WINDOWS TO PREVENT LOOTING AND A GROUP OF ARTISTS SAW AN OPPORTUNITY, TURNING THOSE PLYWOOD BOARDS INTO CANVASS OF THEIR OWN.

HUNDREDS OF MURALS WENT UP IN THE DAYS.

TOING FLOYD'S DEATH, AND OUR NEXT GUEST TONIGHT HAD A FRONT ROW SEAT TO THIS HISTORY AND PHOTOGRAPHED THE ART WORK THAT KURT BOON IS AN ACCLAIMED AUTHOR WHO COMPILED THE PHOTOGRAPHS.

IT'S GREAT TO WELCOME KURT TO THE SHOW.

KURT, IT'S GREAT TO HAVE YOU ON.

OH, THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

ABSOLUTELY.

SO, KURT, I WANT TO YOU TAKE US BACK TO THE BEGINNING OF THE PROTESTS AFTER GEORGE FLOYD'S DEATH.

WHAT WAS THE MOOD LIKE IN NEW YORK CITY?

AND WHAT IS IT THAT MADE YOU HEAD THE LOWER MANHATTAN JUST TO SEE WHAT WAS GOING ON?

YEAH, I WAS WATCHING THE NEWS REPORTS ON VARIOUS CHANNELS, AND I, YOU KNOW, IMMEDIATELY SAW THINGS WERE GETTING PRETTY MUCH HECTIC ON THE STREETS.

AND I SAW IT AND WANTED TO CAPTURE IT, SO I GRABBED MY CAMERA THE NEXT DAY, AND I WENT DOWNTOWN TO WHERE I SAW SOME OF THE PROTESTS.

I FIRST STARTED IN UNION SQUARE.

THERE WERE A LOT OF WINDOWS BROKEN IN STORES.

I STARTED SEEING WORKERS PUT UP PLYWOOD.

RIGHT AFTER THE PROTESTS HAPPENED, YOU KNOW?

AND I STARTED PHOTOGRAPHING THAT.

THEN I KEPT LISTENING TO THE NEWS REPORTS TELLING ME VARIOUS PLACES IN MANHATTAN.

SO NOT JUST SOHO AND UNION SQUARE, BUT IN THE WEST SIDE OF 14th STREET, EVEN IN BROOKLYN.

SO THERE WAS A LOT GOING ON.

BUT I DECIDED AT THE TIME TO LIMIT MYSELF MOSTLY TO MANHATTAN.

THAT WAS ENOUGH RIGHT THERE.

AND THEN --

OF COURSE.

YEAH, AND THEN I WAS PHOTOGRAPHING THE MARCHES PRIMARILY.

I DIDN'T PHOTOGRAPH THE RETAILER AS WELL, BUT MOST OF THE RETAILERS JUST HAD -- AS THE TITLE OF MY BOOK SAID, FRESH PLYWOOD.

AND YOU COULD SMELL IT.

IT WAS BRAND NEW PLYWOOD.

AND SO A LOT OF IT WAS BLANK, BUT IN SOME AREAS OF THE CITY, LIKE UNION SQUARE, SOHO, THEY STARTED WRITING NEGATIVE STUFF TOWARDS THE POLICE, AND I PHOTOGRAPHED THAT.

AND YOU KNOW, I CONTINUED TO FOLLOW THE MARCHING EVERY DAY.

AND GOT KIND OF BUILT UP A LOT OF -- ABOUT WHAT WAS HAPPENING.

EVENTUALLY I SAW AN ARTICLE IN 'THE NEW YORK TIMES' THAT INDICATED THAT ARTISTS HAD STARTED PAINTING THE PLYWOOD IN SOHO.

THEY HAD A FEW PICTURES OF IT IN THE ARTICLE IN 'THE NEW YORK TIMES.'

THAT WAS AROUND JUNE -- I GUESS JUNE 18th, JUNE 20th.

UH-HUH.

AND I WENT OUT THE NEXT DAY TO PHOTOGRAPH WHAT 'NEW YORK TIMES' WAS REPORTING.

BECAUSE I HAD ALREADY PHOTOGRAPHED SOME BUT IT HAD NEGATIVE MARKS ON IT TOWARDS THE POLICE, YOU KNOW, GRAFFITI MARKS TOWARDS IT.

I GO BACK, IMMEDIATELY STARTED SEEING THESE MAGNIFICENT PAINTINGS ON PLYWOOD IN SOHO.

AND SO MY FIRST TWO, LIKE, REALLY STRONG MEMORIES WAS WITH -- ON PRINCE STREET AND BROADWAY.

THERE'S A TRAIN STOP THERE.

THERE WAS ONE PLYWOOD -- I DON'T REMEMBER THE ARTIST'S NAME, BUT IT WAS REALLY DECORATIVE, AND SHE HAPPENED TO BE A LEADER OF A GROUP CALLED ART TO HEART.

ART TO HEART WAS LIKE AN EARLY GROUP THAT PUT A CALL OUT TO ARTISTS TO COME AND PAINT.

SO I PHOTOGRAPHED HER -- HER PAINTINGS, AND THEN ACROSS THE STREET AT PINK STORE ON THE CORNER OF PRINCE AND BROADWAY, THERE WAS ANOTHER SIGNIFICANT MURAL I SAW THAT I SAID, WOW, THIS IS A MASTERPIECE.

IT WAS LIKE SOMEBODY COMING OUT TO SAY SOMETHING SMALL.

THEY REALLY WANTED TO MAKE AN IMPRESSION WITH THEIR ART.

AND THAT PIECE IS ON THE COVER OF MY BOOK 'FRESH PLYWOOD, ARTISTS RISE UP IN THE AGE OF BLACK LIVES MATTER', AND THAT ARTIST WAS CONTANS PATTEN.

EVENTUALLY I WOULD CONTINUE PHOTOGRAPHING THE PLYWOOD, YOU KNOW, FOR THE NEXT, LIKE, THREE MONTHS.

SO IT WAS LIKE, MAY -- END OF MAY, JUNE, JULY, AUGUST, AND BY SEPTEMBER I REALIZED I HAD OVER 300 MURALS.

AND I SAID TO MYSELF, YOU KNOW, WHAT I'M GOING TO DO WITH THIS?

SO I REACHED OUT TO ONE OF MY GRAPHIC DESIGNERS.

HER NAME IS JOSEPHINA MO DECEMBER TO.

WE CALL HER JOJO.

I SAID, TAKE THESE MURALS, AND DON'T MAKE A FANCY BOOK.

WHEN I GIVE THEM TO YOU, JUST LEAVE IT.

SHE DID AS I ASKED, WORKED IT REALLY QUICK.

PUT KNIT A PDF FILE.

AND SHE LIKES DOING COVERS.

I GAVE HER THE THREE IMAGES TO PUT ON THE COVER, AND SHE MADE THIS BEAUTIFUL COVER.

AND I SENT IT OUT TO MY PRINTER AND ILLINOIS AND SAID, HEY, I NEED -- GIVE ME TEN COPY OF THIS.

I WANTED TO SEE WHAT THE REACTION WAS.

MYSELF, BEING A PHOTOGRAPHER AND KNOWING HOW PEOPLE REACT TO STORIES --

UH-HUH.

SOMETIMES THEY DON'T BELIEVE IT UNLESS THEY SEE IT, RIGHT?

WELL, OF COURSE, AND I WOULD IMAGINE THAT THE STORIES THAT YOU WERE GETTING, AT LEAST NOT JUST WHAT THE ART WAS CONVEYING BUT WHAT, AT LEAST, PERHAPS YOU WERE HEARING FROM SOME OF THE ARTISTS AS TO WHY THEY WANTED TO PAINT THESE MURALS MUST HAVE BEEN VERY COMPELLING.

CONSTANCE PATTEN WHO'S ON THE COVER, SHE'S A NATIVE OF -- SHE HAS STRONG CONVICTIONS ABOUT HER HERITAGE.

SHE WANTED TO CONVEY THAT THROUGH HER ART, YOU KNOW?

NOT NECESSARILY LIKE PUSHING EVERYBODY TO SAY SHE WANTS EVERYBODY TO BELIEVE BLACK LIVES MATTER, BUT SHE WANTED TO REALLY CONVEY THE HERITAGE WHERE SHE CAME FROM, AND IN PUTTING THAT OUT ON THE STREETS IS PRETTY SIGNIFICANT FOR HER.

SHE WOULD GO ON TO PAINT MAYBE -- AT LEAST 25, 30 MURALS IN SOHO.

AND SHE WOULD EVENTUALLY FORM A GROUP OF ARTISTS.

SO IT WAS INTERESTING.

AS I PHOTOGRAPHED THESE MURALS, ARTISTS WERE JOINING TOGETHER AND FORMING GROUPS.

RIGHT?

AND THEY WOULD GO AROUND, LOOK FOR EMPTY PLYWOOD, AND THEY WOULD PAINT, YOU KNOW?

AND SO CONSTANCE PATTEN FORM A GROUP WITH AMIR DIOP WHO DID ABOUT 50 MURALS HIMSELF, A YOUNG AFRICAN AMERICAN.

HE'S ABOUT 20 YEARS OLD, AND HE WAS OUT THERE EVERY DAY.

AND HE -- A LOT OF HIS WORK IS PROTEST DRIVEN, WHERE AS, YOU KNOW, CONSTANCE IS MORE NATIVE AMERICAN IMAGERY.

YOU KNOW, BUT IT HAS A STRONG ETHNIC FEEL TO IT.

SO THERE WERE DIFFERENT KINDS OF THEMES THAT WAS COMING THROUGH WITH THESE MURALS.

ABSOLUTELY.

ABSOLUTELY.

AND EVEN THE SIGNIFICANT ABOUT GEORGE FLOYD -- I MEAN, NOT JUST GEORGE FLOYD WAS KILLED BY POLICE BRUTALITY, BUT BREONNA TAYLOR.

MANY OTHER NAMES WERE BEING PAINTED ON THESE PLYWOODS, RIGHT?

AND I GOT THE IMPRESSION THAT NOT JUST THE ARTISTS, BUT THE PROTESTERS THEMSELVES, THEY WANTED TO GET IN THE FACE OF THESE BIG CORPORATIONS TO SAY, YOU KNOW, ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.

LET'S END THIS POLICE BRUTALITY.

AND I JUST -- YOU KNOW, IT WAS JUST MASSIVE, AND I WAS SEEING IT AND I SEEN THE ARTISTS, BY THEM PAINTING ON THEIR PLYWOOD THEY WERE -- YOU HAD TO KIND OF ADDRESS IT IN SOME KIND OF WAY.

THE FACT THAT YOU WERE ABLE TO BE OUT THERE AND CAPTURE SOME OF THE IMAGES, I'M WONDERING, DO YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO THE PHYSICAL ART WORK THAT'S DONE ON THIS PLYWOOD?

I KNOW THAT MANY OF THEM WERE STOLEN AND THE ARTISTS DON'T KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO THEM.

SO I MEAN, THERE WERE ARTISTS WHO WOULD PAINT BEAUTIFUL MURALS AND TWO DAYS LATER IT WAS GONE.

SO THERE'S AN ONGOING THING INSIDE THE ART COMMUNITY THAT PAINTED OUT THERE WHERE THEY'RE SEARCHING FOR THESE MURALS.

I DON'T KNOW HOW SUCCESSFUL THEY'RE GOING TO BE, BUT AR A LOT OF THEM ARE LOST.

SOME STORES THOUGHT THE MURALS WERE THEIR PROPERTY AND THEY DIDN'T GIVE IT BACK TO THE ARTISTS.

WOW.

YEAH, THE ARTISTS DIDN'T DO ANYTHING.

IT'S THEIR PLYWOOD, THEIR STORE, RIGHT?

SOME STORES GAVE THE ARTISTS BACK THE ART PIECE.

SO THERE WERE A FEW ARTISTS THAT, YOU KNOW, GOT SOME OF THEIR PIECES BACK.

IN FACT, IN UNION SQUARE, THERE'S GOING TO BE AN EXHIBITION OF MAYBE 10 OR 12 BOARDS THAT'S GOING TO BE OUT THERE.

THERE'S GOING TO BE AN EXHIBITION OF BOARDS.

I CAN SEND YOU THAT INFORMATION.

SOME OF THEM STILL, THOUGH, ARE IN -- LIKE, YOU CAN STILL SEE SOME OF THE ART WORK FOR AT LEAST THE PUBLIC.

I'M WONDERING -- BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT NECESSARILY NEW TO THIS.

AND I WANT TO AUDIENCE TO ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT YOU HAVE BEEN OUT PHOTOGRAPHING JUST THE STREETS OF NEW YORK FOR YEARS.

SO WAS THERE SOMETHING THAT FELT UNIQUE ABOUT THESE PROTESTS AND THE ART WORK THAT YOU WERE SEEING AS OPPOSED TO YEARS GONE BY, PERHAPS, WITH GRAFFITI THAT WAS ON THE TRAINS OR BUILDINGS.

WAS THERE SOMETHING THAT MADE THIS FEEL DIFFERENT?

WELL, FIRST THING, ABOUT 85% OF THAT BOOK IS IN SOHO, WHICH IS AN UPSCALE RETAIL DISTRICT IN NEW YORK CITY, SO YOUR TOP BRANDS HAVE STORES DOWN THERE.

THAT WAS THE FIRST THING THAT CAME TO MY MIND THAT, HEY, THIS ISN'T NORMAL.

AND THEN THE SECOND THING IS, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE BEING ALLOWED TO PAINT.

THERE WERE NO ARRESTS OF ARTISTS PAINTING THESE STORES.

IT WAS JUST -- I NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE IT, AND THE ARTISTS KIND OF GOT -- THEY FORMED THEIR OWN COMMUNITY, AND I THOUGHT THAT WAS KIND OF UNIQUE IN ITSELF.

BUT IT WAS JUST SOMETHING REALLY UNUSUAL.

IN ALL THE YEARS I HAVE BEEN PHOTOGRAPHING THE STREETS IN NEW YORK, IT'S NOTHING LIKE THAT THAT I'VE EVER SEEN AND THAT I THINK WILL NEVER BE BACK AGAIN, JUST BECAUSE IT WAS UNIQUE.

SPEAKING OF -- AND WE'VE ONLY GOT JUST A FEW SECONDS LEFT, BUT I KNOW YOU ALSO TOOK A TRIP OUT TO MINNEAPOLIS, SO VERY QUICKLY WITH ABOUT 30 SECONDS, WHAT DID YOU TAKE AWAY FROM BEING ABLE TO SEE THE ACTUAL LOCATION OF GEORGE FLOYD'S MURDER AND ALSO THE ART WORK THAT CAME OUT OF THAT CITY?

WELL, MINNEAPOLIS GEORGIA FLOYD SQUARE IS VERY EMOTIONAL.

IT TAKES YOUR BREATH AWAY.

THAT'S WHAT I COULD SAY.

YOU KNOW, SO MANY OFFERINGS THAT WERE OUT THERE.

AND JUST THE CITIZENS OF THAT COMMUNITY JUST SETTING UP THIS MEMORIAL FOR GEORGE FLOYD AND STANDING THEIR GROUND WAS VERY, VERY IMPRESSIVE.

AND I GOT A CHANCE TO SEE SOME OF THE ART WORK OUT THERE AS WELL, SO IT WAS -- IT HAD A PROFOUND EFFECT ON ME SEEING GEORGE FLOYD SQUARE ITSELF, AND I THINK THAT'S A SPECIAL MOMENT IN MY LIFE TO BE A PART OF THE WHOLE TRAGIC EVENT AND BEING ABLE TO DOCUMENT IT AS A FROM EVER AND SAVE IT.

UNFORTUNATELY WE HAVE TO LEAVE IT THERE.

WE'VE RUN OUT OF TIME.

BUT I WANT TO THANK YOU SO MUCH, KURT BOON, YOU'RE THE PHOTOGRAPHER.

YOUR BOOK, OF COURSE, IS 'FRESH PLYWOOD NYC ARTISTS RISE UP IN THE AGE OF BLACK LIVES MATTER'. KURT, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US AND, ABOVE ALL, FOR TAKING THE TIME TO CAPTURE THIS MOMENT IN TIME FOR NEW YORK CITY.

THANK YOU SO MUCH, JENNA.

ABSOLUTELY.

> GOOD EVENING, AND WELCOME TO 'METROFOCUS.'

I AM JACK FORD.

TONIGHT, OUR MENTAL HEALTH CONVERSATION SERIES IS BACK WITH A REVEALING LOOK THAT REPRESSED EMOTIONS AND STRESS CAN HAVE ON OUR BODIES.

POWERFUL EVIDENCE FROM ONE OF OUR GUESTS SHOWS REPRESSION CAN RESULT IN CHRONIC CONDITIONS, HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE, MIGRAINES AND PERSISTENT PAIN.

TONIGHT WE'LL ALSO EXAMINE THE IMPACT STRESS HAS ON THE BODY AND HEALING PROCESS FROM OUR NERVES AND MUSCLES TO OUR OVERALL WELL BEING, AND WHAT YOU CAN ACTUALLY DO ABOUT IT.

SO LET'S WELCOME TWO LEADERS IN THEIR RESPECTIVE FIELDS AS THEY JOIN US HERE IN OUR CONVERSATION.

FIRST, DR. SAMUEL MANN IS A NATIONALLY RECOGNIZED HYPERTENSION SPECIALIST AND PROFESSOR AT CORNELL MEDICAL COLLEGE AND NEW YORK PRESBYTERIAN HOSPITAL.

HE'S THE AUTHOR OF THE NEW BOOK 'HIDDEN WITHIN US', A RADICAL UNDERSTANDING OF MIND/BODY CONNECTION.

AND WE'RE DELIGHTED TO HAVE WITH US DR. JONATHAN PHILLIPS, MEDICAL DIRECTOR OF SPORTS MEDICINE AT PERFORMANCE HEALTH.

SO, GENTLEMAN, WELCOME TO YOU.

THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

THANK YOU.

THANK YOU.

I'M GOING TO ASK BOTH OF YOU START WITH A SIMILAR QUESTION HERE.

DR. MANN, LET ME START WITH YOU, IF I MIGHT.

WHAT LED TO YOU FOCUS ON THIS MIND/BODY CONNECTION AND TAKING A DIFFERENT APPROACH TO MEDICINE AS A RESULT?

MY SPECIALTY IS HYPERTENSION WHICH PROBABLY HAS HAD MORE MIND/BODY RESEARCH.

EVERYBODY THOUGHT IT WAS A MIND/BODY DISORDER.

WHAT I FOUND OUT IN 80% OR MORE IT IS NOT A MIND/BODY DISORDER.

HOWEVER -- AND HYPERTENSION MAY BE A VERY GOOD CONDITION FROM WHICH TO LEARN -- I FOUND THAT WHEN IT IS A MIND/BODY DISORDER, IT WAS VERY DIFFERENT THAN I HAD SUSPECTED AND THAT EVERY SUSPECTS.

AND IT'S A --

DIFFERENT HOW?

DIFFERENT HOW?

DIFFERENT IN THE SENSE THAT THE EMOTIONS INVOLVED WERE EMOTIONS PEOPLE WERE NOT AWARE OF, WHICH WAS A SURPRISE TO THEM AND A SURPRISE TO ME.

AND ONE TYPE OF HYPERTENSION IN PARTICULAR, WHICH WAS FASCINATING.

PEOPLE GET SUDDEN EPISODES OF SEVERE BLOOD PRESSURE ELEVATION OUT OF NOWHERE, NOT RELATED TO CURRENT STRESS.

NOBODY KNEW THE CAUSE.

NOBODY KNEW HOW TO TREAT IT.

AND A COUPLE OF OBSERVATIONS BY THEMSELVES MADE IT SO CLEAR, AND IT JUST LED ME TO LOOK AT IT FURTHER IN HYPERTENSION AND MANY OTHER MEDICAL CONDITIONS.

AND I CAN GIVE YOU A VERY BRIEFCASE OF A PATIENT THAT MAKES IT SO CLEAR.

YEAH, GO AHEAD.

GO AHEAD AND DO THAT TO HELP US UNDERSTAND.

THE PATIENT HAVING YEARS OF THESE EPISODES, MANY OF THEM LEADING TO EMERGENCY ROOM VISITS, HOSPITALIZATIONS, NO EFFECTIVE TREATMENT, NO EXPLANATION, NO CURRENT STRESS, AND I'M TAKING HIS HISTORY -- HE WAS A HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR.

CAN'T HAVE ANYTHING WORSE THAN THAT.

NOW, WHEN I SUGGESTED, I WONDER IF IT'S RELATED TO THAT?

AND HE SAID FIRMLY, NO, THAT WAS DECADES AGO.

AND IT NEVER AFFECTED ME EMOTIONALLY.

AND THAT WAS AN A-HA MOMENT.

THAT'S HOW HE SURVIVED.

THE POINT I WANT TO MAKE IS REPRESSION IS NOT PSYCHOPATHOLOGY.

REPRESSION IS ONE OF OUR MOST POWERFUL DEFENSES AGAINST OVERWHELMING STRESS, AND NOBODY REALIZES IT.

I WANT TO GET TO THAT IN A MINUTE I'VE SEEN YOU ESSENTIALLY SAYING REPRESSION CAN BE A GIFT IN CERTAIN CIRCUMSTANCES.

I'LL COME TO YOU ABOUT THAT AND HOW WE DEAL WITH THAT ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE COIN.

DR. PHILLIPS, SIMILAR QUESTION TO YOU ABOUT YOUR FOCUS ON THE IMPACT THAT STRESS CAN HAVE ON OUR ABILITY TO HEAL.

HOW DID THAT COME ABOUT?

WELL, A LOT OF MY PATIENTS WOULD HAVE AN AILMENT, AND USUALLY THEY WOULD COME TO ME AFTER SEEING ABOUT THREE OR FOUR DIFFERENT PHYSICIANS.

SOME OF THEM SIMPLY MUSCULO SKELETAL OTHERS -- OVERALL SOCIETY OR SOCIETAL BEING, INCLUDING THEIR JOBS, FAMILY LIFE, ET CETERA, AND WITH A LOT OF THAT, WHAT I FOUND WAS PATIENTS WEREN'T JUST GETTING BETTER BY, LET'S SAY, TREATING THEIR SHOULDER.

IT MATTERED WHAT ELSE WAS GOING ON IN THE BODY AND THEIR LIVES.

SO, THE MORE THEY UNDERSTOOD WHAT WAS HAPPENING WITH THEM, WITH THEIR SHOULDER, FOR EXAMPLE, OR WITH ANOTHER BODY PART, AND HOW IT WAS RELATED, THE EASIER IT WAS FOR THEM TO GET THROUGH NOT ONLY THINGS LIKE PHYSICAL THERAPY OR MODELTIES WE HAVE NOW, SURGICAL INTERVENTION, THAT HEALING TIME GOT CUT DOWN QUITE A BIT.

AND ALONG WITH OUR USE OF SOME REGENERATIVE THERAPIES, FOLKS ENDED UP GETTING BETTER A LOT FASTER.

LET ME ASK YOU A FOLLOW-UP ON THAT THOUGHT FOR A SECOND, ON THE NOTION OF HEALING.

AFTER THESE PROBLEMS.

WE WERE TALKING BEFORE WE GOT ON THE AIR HERE.

I HAD IN THE LAST 40 SOME YEARS, 14 ORTHOPEDIC SURGERIES I PLAYED FOOTBALL IN COLLEGE.

IT WAS WONDERFUL.

GOT ME THROUGH COLLEGE AND I LOVED EVERY MOMENT OF IT.

I'D DO IT AGAIN IN A HEART BEAT.

BUT I LOOK AT THE APPROACHES.

FIRST SHOULDER SURGERY WAS BACK IN THE MID 70s.

I HAVE HAD A BUNCH ON BOTH.

I HAD A KNEE REPLACED 12 YEARS AGO AND MAJOR SPINE SURGERY FOR FOUR DISKS TO BE FUSED FOUR YEARS AGO.

WHEN I LOOK AT THE DIFFERENCES IN THE APPROACHES TO THE HEALING PROCESS -- NOT JUST THE STRICTLY MEDICAL APPROACHES WHERE THEY USED TO STRAP YOUR ARM TO YOUR SIDE AND YOU DO NOTHING WITH IT -- AND WE KNOW NOW THAT'S THE WORST POSSIBLE THING TO DO.

I'M GOING TO ASK YOU THE SAME QUESTION, BUT DR. PHILLIPS, YOU FIRST.

SOME PEOPLE THINK THERE'S A RELUCTANCE ON THE PART OF THE MEDICAL PROFESSION TO EMBRACE THESE CHANGES QUICKLY.

IN YOUR AREA, DR. PHILLIPS, ARE YOU SEEING THE PROFESSION HAVING A MUCH MORE WILLINGNESS TO SAY, OKAY, LET'S NOT JUST TALK ABOUT THE PHYSICAL HEALING.

LET'S TALK ABOUT THE MENTAL PROCESS, TOO?

I THINK IT'S STILL VERY MUCH SEGMENTED.

HOWEVER, THERE IS A LOT MORE ACCEPTANCE IN THAT REALM.

I'LL GIVE YOU A SPORTS EXAMPLE.

SO WE TAKE CARE OF A LOT OF NFL FOLKS AND MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL FOLKS, AND IN THAT REALM, THOSE FOLKS ARE USING THEIR BODIES FOR THEIR JOB.

THEY'RE NOT USING A COMPUTER.

THEY'RE NOT PUSHING PAPER.

THEY'RE USING THEIR BODIES.

SO, WHEN THEY HAVE AN INJURY AND THEY'RE TAKEN OUT OF THEIR PLACE OF GROWTH OR EARNING, THERE'S A LOT OF STRESS THAT GOES ALONG WITH THAT.

OUR KEY IS MAKING SURE WE CHANGE THEIR FOCUS NOT TO, OKAY, YOU HAVE AN INJURY, WE NEED TO HEAL IT.

BUT TO, HEY, LISTEN, YOU HAVE A NEW GAME NOW THAT YOU'RE PLAYING.

IT'S CALLED RECOVERY.

AND THIS IS WHERE YOU START, AND THESE ARE THE STEPS FOR RECOVERY.

SO TAKING THE FOCUS AWAY FROM THE STRESSFUL SITUATION OF THEM BEING INJURED AND NOT PLAYING AND FOCUSING IT ON THEIR ACTUAL HEALING PROCESS.

AND THAT'S HELPED A TON OF ATHLETES GET BETTER QUITE A BIT FASTER WITH SORT OF MINIMAL STRESS AND EVEN, ACTUALLY, IMPROVED PERFORMANCE THROUGHOUT.

DR. MANN, HOW ABOUT YOU?

WHEN YOU'RE TALKING, YOU EXPLAIN TO US HOW THIS NOTION HAS EMERGED IN TERMS OF MIND BODY CONNECTION AND DEALING WITH HYPERTENSION AND OTHER DISEASES.

ARE YOU SEEING KIND OF A WILLINGNESS ON THE PART OF THE PROFESSION TO EMBRACE THIS?

OR IS THERE A CAUTION THERE ALSO?

FIRST I HAVE TO SAY THAT THIS IS A VERY NEW UNDERSTANDING, AND IT'S REALLY NOT OUT THERE AT ALL AS OPPOSED TO THE STANDARD OF STRESS AND ANXIETY AND DEPRESSION CAUSED ILLNESS, AND THAT HAS NOT LED TO MUCH HEALTH IN MANAGING MEDICAL ILLNESSES.

THIS IS DIFFERENT.

AND IT IS SO NECESSARY.

I SEE PATIENTS SOMETIMES WHO HAVE CHRONIC FATIGUE SYNDROME.

IF YOU LOOK AT THE MEDICAL LITERATURE, NOBODY KNOWS WHAT CAUSES IT.

NOBODY KNOWS HOW TO TREAT IT.

I FIND MOST OF THOSE PATIENTS HAVE A STORY.

AND ONE THING I EMPHASIZE TO THOSE PATIENTS IS THAT REPRESSION, AGAIN, IS A GIFT.

IT ENABLED THEM TO GET THROUGH ROUGH STUFF --

EXPLAIN THAT A LITTLE BIT MORE FOR US.

BECAUSE YOU MENTIONED THAT, AND I THINK THAT'S IMPORTANT WHEN YOU SAY IT'S A GIFT, AND ON THE OTHER HAND YOU SAY HOW IT CAN BE DAMAGING TO US.

RIGHT.

IT'S A GIFT IN THAT WHEN WE'RE FACING POTENTIALLY OVERWHELMING STRESS -- AND WE DON'T EVEN KNOW IF WE'RE GOING TO SURVIVE PHYSICALLY OR EMOTIONALLY, BEING ABLE TO REPRESS -- AND WE DON'T CONSCIOUSLY REPRESS.

IT'S AN UNCONSCIOUS PROCESS, AND IT ENABLES US TO GET THROUGH THAT PERIOD WITHOUT FALLING APART.

OUR BRAIN IS DOING EXACTLY WHAT WE NEEDED TO DO.

IT'S EXACTLY WHAT EVOLUTION WOULD WANT TO GIVE US TO SURVIVE POTENTIALLY OVERWHELMING STRESS, AND IT'S A KEY POINT OF EMOTIONAL RESILIENCE.

YET, IF YOU LOOK IN BOOKS ON RESILIENCE, THEY DON'T EVEN MENTION REPRESSION, BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE NOT AWARE OF IT.

THE PROBLEM IS THAT THE EMOTIONS ARE POWERFUL.

WE'RE NOT AWARE OF THEM, BUT THEY'RE THERE, AND IN MY PATIENTS, IT'S CLEAR THAT THOSE EMOTIONS LINGER BENEATH OUR AWARENESS AND AFFECT US.

AND IF WE CAN GET IN TOUCH WITH THAT EMOTION AT A TIME LATER WHEN OUR LIFE IS IN ORDER, WE CAN HEAL, AND WE CAN HEAL OFTEN QUICKLY.

LET ME ASK YOU BOTH.

I GOT ABOUT THREE MINUTES LEFT.

WE COULD TALK FOR HOURS ABOUT THIS.

LET ME ASK YOU BOTH THE SAME QUESTION.

THIS BECOMES A MEDICAL NEWS YOU CAN USE OUT THERE.

DR. PHILLIPS, I'LL START WITH YOU.

WHAT DO YOU SAY TO YOUR PATIENTS OR ANYBODY WHO'S WATCHING THIS OUT HERE NOW.

SAY I'M COMING BACK FROM SOME SORT OF PHYSICAL INJURY OR A PROBLEM AND THIS SOUNDS INTERESTING -- WHAT KIND OF -- EXCUSE ME.

WHAT KIND OF GUIDANCE CAN YOU GIVE TO PATIENTS?

AWARENESS.

SO, THE KEY IS BEING AWARE OF EXACTLY HOW YOU FEEL.

YOUR PHYSICIAN SHOULD BE ASKING THAT THROUGHOUT THE PROCESS.

SO, HOW ARE YOU FEELING?

HOW ARE THINGS FEELING?

IS IT AFFECTING ANYTHING?

AND I THINK MAKING SURE THAT A PATIENT GATHERS THAT AWARENESS WILL HELP THEM WITH THEIR STRESS AND HELP THEM WITH THEIR ABILITY TO THINK THROUGH WHY THEY'RE FEELING THE WAY THEY'RE FEELING.

AND ONCE THAT'S SORT OF PUT IN PLACE, THEN THE PHYSICAL HEAL CAN START.

DR. MANN, HOW ABOUT YOU?

SAME QUESTION -- WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO PATIENTS, WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO PEOPLE WHO ARE WATCHING THIS WHO ARE EXPERIENCING SOME OF THESE AILMENTS AND MALADIES THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT HERE ABOUT THAT WHOLE NOTION OF THE MIND/BODY CONNECTION AND WHAT WE CAN DO TO HELP OURSELVES?

I WOULD SAY THREE QUICK THINGS.

ONE, I WOULD EXPLAIN TO THE PATIENT THE POSSIBLE CONNECTION.

SOME PATIENTS WILL GET IT.

SOME MAY NOT.

I WOULD REASSURE THEM THAT THEIR MIND HAD DONE EXACTLY WHAT WAS NECESSARY AT THE TIME.

SOMETIMES THE TRAUMA WAS SO SEVERE IT'S NOT MEANT TO BE -- TO GET IN TOUCH WITH IT.

AND IN THAT CASE, TREATMENT WITH DIFFERENT MEDICATION THAN ONE WOULD ALWAYS USE CAN BE HELPFUL, ALTHOUGH OFTEN IT'S NOT CONSIDERED.

AND THE MAIN POINT IS THAT THIS IS SO NEW IN UNDERSTANDING THAT WE NEED TO STUDY MORE WHAT IS THE BEST WAYS TO ASSIST THE PATIENT IN ABILITY TO GET IN TOUCH WITH STUFF THAT'S INSIDE THAT IS AFFECTING US DESPITE OUR LACK OF AWARENESS OF IT AND RESEARCH NEEDS TO BEGIN TO CONSIDER IT.

THE MESSAGE SEEMS TO BE SIMILAR FOR BOTH OF YOU -- AWARENESS, UNDERSTANDING, AND CERTAINLY A NEED FOR RESEARCH.

DR. JONATHAN PHILLIPS, DR. SAMUEL MAN, THANK YOU BOTH FOR JOINING SCHOOL BUS SHARING.

FASCINATING CONVERSATION.

HOPEFULLY WE CAN CONTINUE THAT CONVERSATION AS WE MOVE ON FORWARD.

SO DOCTORS, BOTH THANK YOU, YOU BOTH BE WELL.

THANK YOU.

THANK YOU.

> 'METROFOCUS' IS MADE POSSIBLE BY -- SUE AND EDGAR WACHENHEIM III, THE PETER G. PETERSON AND JOAN GANZ COONEY FUND, BERNARD AND DENISE SCHWARTZ, BARBARA HOPE ZUCKERBERG, THE AMBROSE MONELL FOUNDATION.