September 26, 2016: Trump vs. Clinton: Round One. Phil Donahue: Pioneer

Tonight is a political television event months in the making. Anticipated to have more viewers around the nation than the Super Bowl, the first presidential debate at Hofstra University is supposed to pull an audience of approximately 100 million people. But with 40 days to go before Election Day, numbers, polls, and ratings are becoming more important than ever. Polls have been crunching numbers non-stop. Currently, Bloomberg.com says it’s a dead heat with a 46 percent tie between the candidates and Nate Silver at 538.com predicts 51.5 percent for Clinton and 48.5 percent for Trump. While the gap closes between the candidates, things are sure to be different by this time tomorrow, and we will have the latest tomorrow night with an in-depth analysis of what’s to come.

Then finally, in 1967, a new show aired on a local station in Dayton, Ohio, that audiences had never seen. The Phil Donahue Show put thought-provoking topics, controversial guests, and the audience together for the first time to create conversations not previously seen on television. The show ran for 29 years and defined the genre of daytime talk TV forever, paving the way for talk show sensations from Oprah Winfrey to Ellen DeGeneres. At the helm of this trail-blazing talk show is Phil Donahue himself, someone who has never been shy to discuss anything from politics, to the media, to Washington, and anything in between. This pioneer of daytime talk joins us tonight to discuss the highs and lows of his career.

TRANSCRIPT

> TONIGHT ON 'METROFOCUS,' IT'S DEBATE NIGHT IN AMERICA AS THE HISTORIC FIRST CLINTON/TRUMP DEBATE KICKS OFF BUT ALSO A GAME OF NUMBERS, POLLS, AUDIENCE, AND OTHERWISE.

A NEW TELEVISION PIONEER WHO'S NEVER SHY WITH HIS OPINION, BILL DONAHUE, WILL BE HERE.

ALL THAT AND MORE AHEAD AS 'METROFOCUS' STARTS RIGHT NOW.

THIS IS 'METROFOCUS.'

WITH RAFAEL PIERMON, JENNA FLANAGAN.

FUNDING FOR THIS PROGRAM WAS PROVIDED BY --

GOOD EVENING, I'M JENNA FLANAGAN.

40 DAYS UNTIL AMERICANS DECIDE THE NEXT PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES WILL BE.

IT'S A GAME OF NUMBERS RIGHT NOW, POLLS AND RATINGS.

IN THE MORNING, THE RATINGS COME IN FOR THE HOFSTRA DEBATE THAT WILL BE ONE FOR THE RECORD BOOKS.

ALL ACCOUNTS, THIS MAY BE THE MOST MASSIVE AUDIENCE TO EVER WATCH A PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE.

THE NUMBER BEING BATTED AROUND IS APPROXIMATELY 100 MILLION PEOPLE.

AND WHEN THAT RATING INFORMATION COMES IN TOMORROW, WE'LL ALSO KNOW IF TONIGHT'S FIRST ROUND DELIVERED THE SAME PUNCH AND BEAT THE RECORD VIEWERSHIP THAT PRESIDENTS CARTER AND REAGAN HIT IN 1980.

THAT NIGHT AS AMERICANS WERE HELD HOSTAGE IN IRAN AS GAS LINES LUNED AND INFLATIONS SOARED, 80 MILLION AMERICANS TUNED IN TO WATCH THE INCUMBENT CARTER SQUARE OFF AGAINST FORMER CALIFORNIA GOVERNOR AND ACTOR RONALD REAGAN.

NEXT TUESDAY, ALL OF YOU WILL GO TO THE POLLS, STAND THERE IN THE HOLDING PLACE AND MAKE A DECISION.

I THINK WHEN YOU MAKE THAT DECISION, IT MIGHT BE WELL THAT YOU WOULD ASK YOURSELF, ARE YOU BETTER OFF THAN YOU WERE FOUR YEARS AGO?

IS IT EASIER FOR YOU TO GO AND BUY THINGS IN THE STORE THAN FOUR YEARS AGO?

IS THERE MORE OR LESS UNEMPLOYMENT IN THE COUNTRY THAN THERE WAS FOUR YEARS AGO?

IS AMERICA AS RESPECTED THROUGHOUT THE WORLD AS IT WAS?

DO YOU FEEL THAT OUR SECURITY IS AS SAFE, THAT WE'RE AS STRONG AS WE WERE FOUR YEARS AGO?

AND IF YOU ANSWER ALL OF THOSE QUESTIONS, YES, THEN I THINK YOUR CHOICE IS OBVIOUS AS TO WHO YOU'LL VOTE FOR.

IF YOU DON'T AGREE, IF YOU DON'T THINK THAT THE COURSE WE'VE BEEN ON FOR THE LAST FOUR YEARS IS WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE US FOLLOW FOR THE NEXT FOUR, THEN I COULD SUGGEST ANOTHER CHOICE THAT YOU HAVE.

IT WAS A TURNING POINT IN AMERICAN HISTORY.

TOMORROW MORNING HAS A PROMISE OF BEING ONE OF THOSE DAYS.

THE OTHER SET OF NUMBERS TO WATCH IN THE MORNING, THE ALL IMPORTANT POLLS.

TODAY, THIS REVELATION.

A DEAD HEAT BETWEEN CLINTON AND TRUMP ON BLOOMBERG.COM.

BOTH TIED AT 46%. REAL CLEAR POLITICS REPORTS PROFESSOR ALEX J. LIPMAN PREDICTS A TRUMP VICTORY.

HE'S HAD A 100% ACCURACY RATE WHEN IT COMES TO PREDICTING THE WINNER OF THE PRESIDENCY AND INCREDIBLY ACCURATE NATE SILVER AT 538.COM AS 51.5% FOR CLINTON AND 48.5% GOING TO TRUMP.

TOMORROW MORNING WILL BRING A FRESH SET OF NUMBERS ON ALL FRONTS AND WE'LL HAVE THE LATEST TOMORROW NIGHT INCLUDING IN-DEPTH ANALYSIS RIGHT HERE ON 'METROFOCUS.'

TOMORROW, A FRONT LINE SPECIAL ALSO ABOUT THE RACE FOR THE WHITE HOUSE, THE CHOICE DEBUTS.

LET'S TAKE A LOOK.

IN THIS REALITY TELEVISION, THIS IS ACTUAL REALITY.

BEFORE AMERICA VOTES, IN THIS HISTORIC ELECTION, A TWO HOUR SPECIAL REPORT THAT'S LESS ABOUT WHAT THEY SAY AND MORE ABOUT WHO THEY ARE.

WHAT WAS THE ONE THING THAT EVERYBODY IN AMERICA KNEW ABOUT HILLARY CLINTON?

SHE'S TOUGH.

THIS IS A GUY WHO SAYS, IF YOU HIT ME, I'LL HIT YOU BACK TEN TIMES HARDER.

BOTH TAKE A HARD SIDE BY SIDE LOOK AT BOTH CANDIDATES.

'LIFE' MAGAZINE.

SUDDENLY, SHE IS EMBLEMATIC OF HER GENERATION.

THE ART OF MAKING WHAT APPEARS TO BE IMPOSSIBLE, POSSIBLE.

TO REVEALING STORIES.

THINK OF THIS 13-YEAR-OLD KID WHO'S GROWING UP IN A MANSION WITH EVERYTHING HE COULD POSSIBLY WANT.

AND THEN ALL OF THE SUDDEN, GOOD-BYE LUXURY, HELLO, DRILL SERGEANT.

WHAT WAS IT ABOUT BILL CLINTON THAT MADE YOU FALL IN LOVE?

SAID, HE WASN'T AFRAID OF ME.

WILLIAM JEFFERSON.

WHEN HE IS IMPEACHED, SHE'S BELIEF BUT IS HILLARY WHO COMES TO THE RESCUE?

THEIR LIVES.

HIS FATHER INTRODUCED DONALD TO HOW TO GET THINGS DONE INSIDE THE NEW YORK POLITICAL PROCESS.

LAWYER.

JOE McCARTHY'S LEGAL COUNSEL DURING 1950.

TAUGHT DONALD HOW TO COME OUT PUNCHING, USE LAWSUITS LIKE MACHINE GUN BULLET.

THEIR STRUGGLES.

NONE SHOULD HAVE BEEN ON ANY CLASSIFIED SYSTEM.

THIS WAS THE OLD HILLARY.

SECRECY, DENIAL.

I'M NOT GOING TO LET THEM KNOW BECAUSE THEY'LL USE IT AGAINST ME.

THE APPRENTICE WAS DESIGNED TO MAKE HIM LOOK LIKE A FORTUNE 500 CEO.

IN THE REAL WORLD, HIS OWN BUSINESS IS BLOWING UP AROUND HIM.

AND COMEBACKS.

THERE IS AN OLD MONEY ELITE THAT HAVE NEVER ACCEPTED DONALD.

THIS IS WHERE HIS RESENTMENT OF THE ELITE COMES FROM.

AND HE SAYS TO THE BANKER, I'M WORTH MORE TO YOU ALIVE THAN DEAD.

SO TWO CHOICES.

LOSE EVERYTHING OR WORK WITH ME AND WE'LL WORK OUT OF THIS.

THE DAY THE SENATE VOTES TO ACQUIT BILL CLINTON IN THE WHITE HOUSE WITH MAPS OF NEW YORK STATE LAID OUT IN FRONT OF HER.

AND SHE TOLD ME, THAT WAS THE FIRST TIME IN 53 YEARS THAT I SPOKE WITH MY OWN VOICE AS MY OWN POLITICAL PERSON.

FROM FRONT LINES AWARD WINNING POLITICAL TEAM.

I THINK IN THE HEART OF HEARTS, SHE REALLY BELIEVES SHE'S ALL ABOUT DOING GOOD FOR OTHERS AND I THINK THE FACTS BEAR HER OUT BUT ANOTHER LEAD TAKES PLACE WHICH IS NOTHING I DO IN THE PURSUIT OF HELPING OTHERS CAN BE BAD THEN.

THE STORY OF WHO THEY REALLY ARE.

DONALD TRUMP IS RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT BECAUSE HE TRULY BELIEVES HE CAN HELP TURN THE NATION AROUND.

MORE IMPORTANTLY, EVERY CRITIC, EVERY DETRACTOR WILL HAVE TO BOW DOWN TO PRESIDENT TRUMP.

NO MATTER WHERE YOU STAND.

THE VOTERS ARE DISTRUSTFUL OF OLD PARTIES, REPUBLICANS OR DEMOCRATS.

IT'S A CHOICE BETWEEN POLITICS AS WE'VE KNOWN IT AND POLITICS AS IT MIGHT BE BECOMING.

THE CHOICE 2016.

ONLINE OR ON AIR BEGINNING SEPTEMBER 27th.

CBS NEWS.

ROB FLEMING.

WHICH I'VE DISCUSSED TONIGHT.

INSOFAR AS HIS STATEMENT.

IN 1967, ON A LOCAL STATION IN DAYTON, OHIO, A NEW SHOW AIRED THAT WAS SOMETHING AUDIENCES HAD NEVER SEEN BEFORE.

THE PHIL DONAHUE THOUGHT PROVOKING TOPICS AND CONTROVERSIAL GUESTS IN CONVERSATION WITH NOT ONLY THE HOST BUT ALSO MEMBERS OF THE STUDIO AUDIENCE.

IT WAS SOON A HUGE SUCCESS.

DONAHUE RAN FOR 29 YEARS.

IT DEFINED AND CHANGED THE GENRE OF DAYTIME TALK TELEVISION FOREVER AND PAVED THE WAY FOR OTHERS INCLUDING OPRAH WINFREY AND ELLEN DeGENERES AND MORE THAN A TALK SHOW PIONEER.

NEVER BEEN RELUCTANT TO DISCUSS THE STATE OF NEWS IN AMERICA AND ALL THAT'S GOING ON IN WASHINGTON.

AND THEN THERE'S THAT WONDERFUL MARRIAGE TO MARLEAU THOMAS.

JOINING ME TO TALK ABOUT SOME OF HIS CAREER AND HIS THOUGHTS ON WHAT'S GOING ON NOW WITH THE WORLD IS THE LEGENDARY PHIL DONAHUE.

GOOD TO SEE YOU.

PLEASURE.

I DON'T KNOW WHEN WE SAW EACH OTHER LAST.

AWAYS.

THE LAST TIME, I DON'T THINK YOU CALLED ME LEGENDARY.

BUT THANK YOU.

I THINK IT'S THE APPROPRIATE TITLE.

THANK YOU.

LET ME START TALKING ABOUT YOUR SHOW WHEN YOU STARTED.

WHEN YOU STARTED DOING IT, REALLY, WHAT WAS YOUR EXPECTATION ABOUT THIS NEW TELEVISION THING THAT YOU WERE DOING?

I KNEW THAT THE COIN OF OUR REALM IS THE SIZE OF THE AUDIENCE.

WHAT WILL DRAW OUR CROWD?

ESPECIALLY TO A VISUALLY DULL PROGRAM, AND WE GOT CONTROVERSY.

CONTROVERSY IS WHAT WILL DO IT.

I WAS LUCKY BECAUSE THE RATINGS WERE SO GOOD THAT WE HAD A GENERAL MANAGER WHO DIDN'T PANIC AND REMEMBER, WE ARE A LOCAL SHOW NOW.

WE'RE NOT ON A NETWORK.

WE WERE ON A NETWORK, WE'D HAVE LEFT IN SIX MINUTES.

BUT THE RATINGS KEPT US ALIVE.

WE FEATURED A HOMOSEXUAL IN THE FIRST WEEK OF THE SHOW.

WELL, THAT REALLY, I MEAN, THIS IS 1957.

I MEAN.

IN 1957, THOSE WERE NOT SUBJECTS DISCUSSED.

NOBODY WAS OUT.

AND YOU'RE RIGHT.

IT WAS BAD.

BUT, OH MY GOODNESS, THE PHONES RANG OFF THE HOOK.

WHEN DID YOU GET THE SENSE THAT, YOU KNOW WHAT?

THIS SHOW IS GOING TO WORK AND IT'S GOING TO WORK BIGGER THAN I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE.

THE FIRST RATING BOOK, WE HAD A 50 SHARE AND THAT'S INSIDE FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE BUT JUST A FABULOUS RATING.

A HUGE NUMBER.

YEAH.

AND SO THE HOSTILITY FOR THESE SHOWS WE WERE DOING, WE DID, AND I KNEW WE HAD TO DO THIS.

WE DON'T DO THIS, WE'LL BE PARKING CARS.

WE DID A SHOW ON THE ANATOMICALLY CORRECT DOLL.

YOU MAY NOT REMEMBER THIS.

I DO.

THERE WAS A GREAT DEAL OF CONTROVERSY ON HAVING AN ANATOMICALLY CORRECT DOLL.

I HELD THIS DOLL UP.

LITTLE MALE DOLL, SANS DIAPER WITH THE LITTLE TALLY WHACKER THERE.

YOU THINK THIS DOLL WAS APPROPRIATE FOR CHILDREN?

IF YOU DO, CALL BALDWIN.

IF YOU DON'T, CALL BALDWIN 19 -- THE ENTIRE BALDWIN EXCHANGE WENT OUT, COLLAPSED.

THE TELEPHONE COMPANY WAS MAKING EMERGENCY EFFORTS TO GET TO US TO TELL US, PLEASE, STOP.

PEOPLE, WHAT IF YOU'RE BLEEDING TO DEATH OR NEED AN AMBULANCE?

A HEART ATTACK.

THIS DAMN DOLL, THE AMBULANCES NEVER GOING TO GET TO YOUR HOUSE AND I DIDN'T EVEN REALIZE THE IMPORTANCE OF THE AUDIENCE.

I FELT LIKE THE THIRD SHOW DURING THE COMMERCIALS, THEY WERE ASKING SOME VERY GOOD QUESTIONS OF THE GUESTS.

AND SO THE FOURTH SHOW, I JUST TOOK THE MIKE AND JUMPED OUT OF MY SEAT AND WENT OUT IN THE AUDIENCE.

SO THAT'S HOW THAT HAPPENED.

BASICALLY, JUST ORGANIC.

IT WAS.

AND I WASN'T, NOBODY WAS BRILLIANT ENOUGH TO THINK, HEY, IF WE DO THIS OR THAT.

AND REMEMBER AT THE TIME, THERE WAS A REAL PREJUDICE AGAINST STUDIO AUDIENCES.

YOU MAY REMEMBER, SOMETIMES THEY WERE BEHIND THE RED GEL AND YOU COULD HARDLY MAKE THEM OUT.

THE ATTITUDE ON THE PART OF MANY BLUE SUITS IN OUR GAME, THE ATTITUDE SEEMED TO BE, THIS IS A NICE PLACE TO WORK.

ALL OF THESE PEOPLE COMING HERE ALL THE TIME AND STARTED TO BE BORING, BUT THE AIR WAVES BELONG TO THE PEOPLE.

SO WE DID THIS RADICAL THING CALLED DEMOCRACY.

WE LET THEM USE THE AIR WAVES.

WE TOOK THE CAMERAS BEHIND THE AUDIENCE AND BROUGHT THE AUDIENCE OFF.

I'M OUT STEPPING OUT AND THIS IS BEFORE WIRELESS.

AND I WOULD RUN TO THE BACK ROW WITH A LADY HAD HER HAND UP, STRANGLE THREE PEOPLE IN THE FRONT ROW.

THAT'S HOW WE STARTED AND THE WOMEN IN THE AUDIENCE WERE ASKING, YOU COULD, THEY WANTED THE SHOW FOR A LONG TIME AND NOBODY GAVE IT TO THEM.

LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT THE CULTURE.

WE LOOK AT THE NEWS BUSINESS, ESPECIALLY THE CABLE.

IS NOW DRIVEN, PRIMETIME, ALMOST EXCLUSIVELY, THEY'RE NOT NEWSCASTS ANYMORE, WHAT YOU AND I REMEMBER.

THEY'RE OPINION DRIVEN TALK SHOWS.

MM-HMM.

IS THAT A GOOD THING IN THE MEDIA WORLD, DO YOU THINK?

WELL, YOU CERTAINLY DON'T WANT TO OUT LOT.

IT HAS DRAWBACKS.

FIRST OF ALL, IT'S CHEAP.

EASY TO PRODUCE.

BUT IT DOES LEND ITSELF TO ORATION AND POPPING OFF.

IT'S REALLY TAKEN OVER THE PRESIDENTIAL, OUR ELECTORAL POLITICS.

TELEVISION RUNS THE PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION, FOR EXAMPLE.

IT JUST DOES.

AND IT IS THE GORILLA IN THE CORNER OF THE ROOM.

AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S SUCH A GOOD IDEA.

ESPECIALLY WHEN IT'S SO DIFFICULT TO DISSENT NOW IN AMERICA.

PEOPLE JUST DON'T LIKE.

WHY DO YOU THINK THAT IS?

YOU'RE ON AIR IN THE '60s.

I WAS IN COLLEGE IN THE '60s.

PEOPLE WERE DRIVEN BY DISSENT.

IT WAS THE VIETNAM WAR.

THE COLLEGE GENERATION SAYING, WE DON'T WANT TO DO IT THE WAY YOU USED TO.

WE'LL SHUT IT DOWN.

SO IN PART, HAD TO HAVE BEEN AN ENORMOUS PART OF THE SHOW, GOING ON.

WHAT DO YOU THINK NOW, WHY DO YOU SAY THAT, IT'S FAR MORE DIFFICULT?

MY GRANDMOTHER HAD A SAYING AND I'M SURE YOURS DID TOO.

PROBABLY THE SAME ONE.

THEY SHOW A PERSON WHO WAS FULL OF THEMSELVES.

HE'S FULL OF HIMSELF.

YOU KNOW, AND IN SOME WAYS, AMERICA HAS BECOME FULL OF ITSELF.

THE LAST REMAINING SUPER POWER.

THE LEADER OF THE FREE WORLD.

EXCEPTIONALISM.

YOU KNOW, A LOT OF THAT, I THINK, IS TRUE.

BUT I THINK IT WOULD BE BETTER FROM ANOTHER COUNTRY SAID THAT ABOUT.

WE ARE FULL OF OURSELVES, AND THE RESULT, I THINK, IS THAT DISSENT IS JUST NOT TOLERATED.

IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT DISSENT DOESN'T EXIST.

IT DOES.

BUT IT'S NOT VERY WELCOME.

IT'S CERTAINLY NOT POPULAR.

IT'S NOT GOING TO GET YOU, YOU KNOW, A PLAQUE FROM THE CHAMBER OF COMMERCE.

YOU ARE EXPECTED TO.

YOU KNOW, EVERY MAJOR METROPOLITAN NEWSPAPER IN THIS COUNTRY SUPPORTED THE INVASION OF IRAQ.

GET YOUR BRAIN AROUND THAT.

THE LAND OF FREE SPEECH, FIRST AMENDMENT.

THE LAND WHERE WE WANT THE PRESS TO BE A CACOPHONY OF VOICES PUSHING BACK AND FORTH AND IF YOU DESCEND, YOU'RE TOLD TO SHUT UP AND SING.

AND IT PROMOTES WAR.

WE'VE BECOME A WARRIOR NATION.

AND I RESPECT THOSE WHO WENT TO WAR, PRESERVED OUR FREEDOMS, AND SO MANY WAYS.

BUT ONE OF THE FREEDOMS THEY PRESERVED IS THAT OF FREE SPEECH, AND WHEN IT COMES TO WAR, WE'RE TOLD TO SHUT UP AND SING.

WELL, WHY SACRIFICE ALL THIS INNOCENT BLOOD?

YOU KNOW, YOU CAN HAVE ANY KIND OF COMFORT YOU WANT.

WE COULD HAVE A KNEEL MUSSOLINI AND HE'LL TELL US WHAT'S GOOD FOR US AND WE'LL ALL SHUT UP AND SING.

I DON'T WANT THAT KIND OF COUNTRY.

LET ME ASK YOU A LAST QUESTION ABOUT THE MEDIA AND FOCUSING PRIMARILY ON THE PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN.

OBVIOUSLY, YOU HAD YOUR SHOW GOING ON THROUGH A NUMBER OF PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGNS.

YOU HAD CONVERSATIONS ABOUT THE CAMPAIGNS.

HOW THEY WERE COVERED, SHOULD BE COVERED.

AND YOU LOOK AT HOW THIS CAMPAIGN HAS BEEN.

INDEPENDENT.

I'M NOT COMING AT THIS FROM ANY PARTICULAR PARTY.

AND I THINK, OFTEN, ONE OF MY MENTORS, THE LEGENDARY FRED FRIENDLY.

OFTEN CALLED THE CONSCIENCE OF TELEVISION NEWS AND FRED TOLD ME WHEN I WAS A YOUNG PERSON GETTING INVOLVED IN THE JOURNALISM BUSINESS, HE SAID TO ME, JACK, HE SAID, HERE'S YOUR JOB.

YOUR JOB IS TO BE A RESPECTFUL SKEPTIC AND EACH OF THOSE COMPONENTS ARE AS IMPORTANT AS THE OTHER.

SKEPTIC PART AND THE RESPECTFUL PART.

YOU SEE THAT IN THE MEDIA TODAY, ESPECIALLY WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT CAMPAIGN COVERAGE?

WELL, I SEE IT IN SOME.

I HAVE LEARNED THE HARD WAY THAT THE PRESS IS FULL OF ITSELF IN MANY WAYS.

MAINSTREAM MEDIA IS, I THINK, THIN SKINNED, NOT REALLY OPEN TO CRITICISM, AND THEY'RE REWARDED FOR BEING POPULAR.

AND SKEPTICS ARE OFTEN NOT POPULAR.

SO MEDIA HAS A PROBLEM.

THEY'RE BETWEEN A ROCK AND A HARD PLACE.

BEING A SKEPTIC EVERY DAY AND CRITICIZING, YOU KNOW, IT DOES NOT GET YOU PROMOTED.

I OUGHT TO KNOW.

AND DOESN'T MAKE YOU A LOT OF FRIENDS.

CERTAINLY NOT WITHIN THE POWER.

MEDIA'S SO DEPENDENT ON CORPORATE ADVERTISING AND REVENUE.

IT JUST IS HESITANT TO ROCK THE BOAT.

WHEN I WAS IN MICHIGAN FOR WABJ, I WAS IN THE NEWS DEPARTMENT, THE ONLY PERSON IN THE NEWS.

YOU WERE THE NEWS DEPARTMENT.

I WAS THE NEWS DIRECTOR, YOU KIDDING ME, YOU KNOW.

AND I HAD A MICROPHONE RADIO THAT SAID WABJ ON THE TOP.

AND I COULD STOP THE MAYOR BY THAT AND I WAS JUST OUT OF NOTRE DAME.

1920, WHATEVER IT WAS, I MUST HAVE LOOKED WELL AND COULDN'T GET OVER HOW POWERFUL I LOOKED AND THAT WAS THE FIRST LESSON THAT I HAD ON FIRST, HOW POWERFUL MEDIA WAS, HOW IMPORTANT IT WAS.

HOW EASY IT IS TO SEDUCE THE MEDIA.

I WANTED TO BE POPULAR.

TO BE SEDUCED BY THE MEDIA.

AND THE GLORY OF IT.

I WANTED TO BE POPULAR.

I WAS NEWLY MARRIED, YOU KNOW, 1.5 KIDS.

AND I DIDN'T WANT TO ROCK ANY BOATS.

YOU KNOW?

IT'S A VERY TOUGH SITUATION, ESPECIALLY FOR YOUNG PEOPLE.

AMBITIOUS, LIKE ME, WHO WANTED TO SUCCEED AND.

IT'S A BUSINESS MADE UP OF AMBITIOUS PEOPLE.

THAT'S RIGHT.

AND I'M REPORTING TO A GENERAL MANAGER, WHO IN TURN, REPORTS TO THE OWNER, WHO PLAYS GOLF WITH ALL THE SPONSORS.

YOU KNOW, WHAT'S THAT GRAY HAIRED GUY DOING ON YOUR SHOW?

WHY IS HE ASKING ME HARD QUESTIONS?

AND WHY IS HE TALKING TO GAY PEOPLE?

WHY IS HE TALKING TO ATHEISTS?

YOU KNOW, THE FIRST NAME ISN'T JACK.

COME ON.

GET OFF IT NOW.

AND HE'S A BIG SPONSOR.

YOU'RE NOT GOING TO FOOL AROUND WITH THIS.

YOU CAN'T GIVE HIM A LESSON ON THE FIRST AMENDMENT WHILE YOU'RE GOING DOWN THE THIRD FAIRWAY.

IT CONSPIRES TO GIVE YOU A RA RA MEDIA WHICH IS WHAT HAPPENED IN THE IRAQ WAR, WHICH IS THE SUCCESS OF FOX NEWS.

MY GOODNESS.

FOX NEWS IS THE BIGGEST RA RA MEGAPHONE IN THE HISTORY OF BROADCASTING.

LOOK AT THE BUSINESS MODEL, IT'S DOING VERY WELL WITH THE CORPORATE.

$1 BILLION NET.

NET PROFIT A YEAR.

I MEAN, RUPERT IS THE KING OF THE CEOs.

NOW, WE DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN NOW WITH THE SCANDAL THAT HAS HIT FOX.

ROGER AILS WORKED WITH.

I WAS ON MSNBC.

I WAS ON MSNBC THE DAY IT FIRST STARTED, 1994, WHATEVER IT WAS.

THERE YOU GO.

I KNOW I HEARD YOUR VOICE SOMEWHERE.

I HAD A SHOW WITH VLADIMIR POZNER, A COMMUNIST.

I REMEMBER THE SHOW.

WHO I HAD DONE A SPACE BRIDGE WITH.

I'M IN SEATTLE AND HE WAS IN LENNENGRAD.

AND SIMULTANEOUS TRANSLATION AND EVERYBODY HAD EARPHONES, YOU KNOW?

RIGHT.

AND I WAS SCARED TO DEATH BECAUSE, I MEAN, I AM ALREADY CONSIDERED LIBERAL.

THAT'S NOT A CAREER ADVANCING THING TO BE.

AND I SAID, YOU KNOW, OH, THERE GOES DONAHUE.

DUKE NOW OF THE KGB.

I SAID TO VLADIMIR AND THE PEOPLE IN RUSSIA WHO WERE, SOVIET UNION AT THE TIME.

CAN I SAY ANYTHING?

YES.

YOU'LL CUT IT OUT?

NO.

GORBACHEV CAME TO POWER IN APRIL AND WE DID THIS THING IN DECEMBER.

AND I'M LIKE, FIVE MINUTES INTO THE SHOW AND I'M GOING TO PROVE THAT THIS IS LEGIT.

AND I'M SAYING.

WHY DO YOU ALLOW OLD MEN BEHIND CLOSED DOORS TO DECIDE WHAT'S GOOD FOR YOU?

THE CAMERA TOOK A PICTURE OF THE SOVIET AUDIENCE LIKE THIS AND THEY LOOKED LIKE THE DEER IN THE HEADLIGHTS.

WHY IS SOCER OFF?

WHY DOES IT SAY JEW ON YOUR PASSPORT?

THESE PEOPLE HAVE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THIS.

IF QUESTIONS.

AND EVERYBODY OVER THERE, I DIDN'T REALIZE IT, EVERYBODY OVER IN THE CONTROL ROOM STOPPED BREATHING.

YOU'RE TALKING JOB NOW.

AND PERHAPS EVEN MORE.

THAT'S RIGHT.

SO WE DID.

WE TAPED OVER TWO HOURS.

AND VLADIMIR TOLD ME LATER, THEY TOOK IT TO GORBACHEV.

THIS IS POZNER NOW AND HE LOOKED AT IT AND THESE PEOPLE ARE WHITE.

THEY CAN'T, YOU KNOW.

AND HE GETS ALL FINISHED WATCHING IT.

AND YOU CAN CHECK THIS WITH VLADIMIR.

I'M NOT MAKING ANY OF THIS UP.

HE SAYS, THIS WILL BE OUR GIFT TO THE 22nd CONGRESS OF THE COMMUNIST PARTY.

WHICH WAS GOING TO HAPPEN.

IT WAS THE FIRST EXPRESSION OF GLOSSNESS.

REMEMBER, AND NOW IT'S LITERALLY A MOMENT IN HISTORY FOR SOVIETS AND THEN TO BECOME RUSSIAN CITIZENS.

WE COULD TALK FOR HOURS.

I'M SORRY.

BUT AS YOU KNOW, THIS IS SO ENJOYABLE.

I'M HOPING I CAN GET YOU BACK HERE TO TALK.

I HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF THINGS I WANT TO DO.

BUT MARLEAU AS WELL.

I'LL SAY YOU SAID HELLO.

YOU BE WELL.

THANK YOU.

TALKING ABOUT HIS ALMA MATER, CATHOLIC UNIVERSITY OF NOTRE DAME AND THEIR SUPPORT FOR LGBT STUDENTS AND ALUMNI.

INTERESTING CONVERSATION.

BE SURE TO TUNE IN.

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